Grad School Abroad? - TravelPUNK Backpacker College Student Budget Travel Message Boards!

**NitemareHippieGirl** · 09-11-2008, 03:11 PM

I think I've changed my mind at least three times a day about what to do after graduating, but now I'm thinking about grad school again.

I suppose to be specific I should just toss it out that I'm pretty dead set on living in England for awhile after graduating. Not thinking about the money and all that so much right now, basically it's what I want to do so I'm going to do what I need to do to do it...

Anyway. My parents are both college professors and therefore think getting a masters abroad is a BAAAAAAAD idea because the MA in England is only a one year degree and won't transfer if I decide to get a PhD in the US or teach in the US (because ony of my career goals is to be a univ. prof.)

Anyone have any grad experience abroad? How hard was it to transfer an MA from the UK to a US school and can I get a job anywhere?!????!?!?!?

I'm totally lost right now, I know what I ultimately want to do, but my parents can't help but fill me with the fear of dying poor, alone, and unhappy. HELP!!!

**NitemareHippieGirl** · 09-11-2008, 03:13 PM

I don't know if it would help to mention that I'm graduating with a BA in English and am looking into programs on English Lit, journalism, rhetoric and composition, or education.

**pinknic38** · 09-11-2008, 03:59 PM

I'm with ya man, I was looking at grad school abroad myself because I gotta take the GRE in the spring, cos one of my long term goals is to teach at the university level.

I was looking at doing maybe a school int he US that had an exchange program or something. I know you can study abroad for grad school. But as far as wanting a legitimate degree abroad and wanting to teach HERE in the US, that's kind of a hard situation.

Maybe it's possible to do a 1 year program that will transfer to an MA program in the US and you just come back to the US to finish your MA....?

**offhegoes03** · 09-11-2008, 06:01 PM

I don't know about how the degrees transfer, but my friend is going to Oxford in the fall for a masters in Women's Studies. I also had a friend who did Archaeology at Cambridge, and I know he's gotten jobs in the US, but I don't think he tried to transfer anything to get a PhD.

It sounds like an awesome idea, but if one of your dreams is to become a university prof, you might want to try contacting some schools that you might want to get your phd from and see if they would transfer all of the credits or if you'd have to make up some of them. Good luck!

**pinknic38** · 09-12-2008, 09:30 AM

yeah I have been checking out grad schools today cos I'm trying to see who all requires a GRE, and because MY field of study recommends that you "diversify" your studies by doing an MA somewhere and a PhD somewhere else if that's your long term goal (which, face it, an MA in anthropology is about as worthless as a BA... you gotta have that PhD), because they don't want "academic inbreeding"... this is what my advisor told me:

He forwarded me a link with a list of good MA programs in my field (which is physical anthropology for the MA, drilled down to forensics/skeletal osteology for a PhD), and a few of them are actually abroad. One being Cambridge (I would shit twice and die if I got into Cambridge... it's like one of the top 5 anthropology graduate schools in the world) and another being Univeristy of Leipzig, which would be awesome, uhh Univeristiy of Sheffield, University of Manitoba, University of Tornonto... and apparently I can get a Master in Skeletal Anthropology at Universidad Autónoma de Yucatán which would be exactly what I want except I don't know how reputable the program is.

I asked my advisor how these translate into a PhD and he said that plenty of people in our field go abroad and often it's looked highly upon because my field is big on this no academic inbreeding thing, so the more diversified, the better. But often times they're a 1 year degree, but like Cambridge's program also offers a research degree too. He also said that if it takes awhile or you get sidetracked traveling, etc, it's almost all the better, because when you go to be considered as a PhD candidate, they're looking for "maturity" as far as academics and experience. Ultimately, it's up to each university as to what they require, but it apparently should be no issue to call another school and ask.

So that's the information I got from my advisor, hope this helps!

**simply_angelic** · 09-12-2008, 10:08 AM

Can you not jump straight into a PhD program in England?

**pinknic38** · 09-12-2008, 11:16 AM

I have no idea, but in the US you can do both depending on your field of study and/or school.

For example, I could go to Ohio State for my MA in physical anthropology and then down to UTenn for my PhD in anthro

Or, I could go to Northwestern where they only award an MA to PhD seeking candidates, and get my MA and PhD, and really the MA is only awarded as a 2 year point into your PhD at Northwestern.

But I think that major really makes a difference as to how you go about it.

**offhegoes03** · 09-12-2008, 12:30 PM

pinknic38- my friend did the anthro program at Cambridge. I can ask him what he did to get in if you want. He really enjoyed it from what I know.

**pinknic38** · 09-12-2008, 12:34 PM

OMG!!!!! yes!!! ask him what his GRE score was (if he doesn't mind), GPA, extracurriculars, other stuff.... that would be amazing!!!!!

**simply_angelic** · 09-12-2008, 02:40 PM

There's a program in sussex as well I believe...My friend is doing her anthro PhD there...and I dont think she did her master's first, but I could be wrong. She was researching down on the Rwandan/DRC border when I met her...

**pinknic38** · 09-12-2008, 03:12 PM

is she cultural anthropology? sounds like it (anthro is divided into 3 disciplines... cultural, physical, and archaeology). it's tricky looking for a grad program in antrho cos you gotta read the fine print as to which discipline it is.

**offhegoes03** · 09-12-2008, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pinknic38

OMG!!!!! yes!!! ask him what his GRE score was (if he doesn't mind), GPA, extracurriculars, other stuff.... that would be amazing!!!!!

I know he was the president of my fraternity, and he participated in some archeological digs at my old school (William and Mary, located near Colonial
Williamsburg and Jamestown, so there's tons of old archeological work to be done). I can ask him about his GRE scores and GPA so you can have something to compare yours to.

edit: I'll also find out exactly what discipline of antrho he went into, but I think it was archaeology.

**offhegoes03** · 09-12-2008, 11:50 PM

Pinknic38 - Here's what my friend sent me:

My undergrad GPA was 3.62 and my GRE was a combined 1290 (I got 580 on math and 710 on the verbal part -- but that was in 2004 and I think the GRE has changed format since then). But as far as I remember they didn't ask for GRE scores -- just the GPA and some other academic stuff. I think they put a lot of emphasis on letters of recommendation and the writing sample.

He studied Archaeology though, but he definitely recommends Cambridge. He says it was challenging, but really rewarding.

Hah, also, sorry for hijacking the original thread!

**pinknic38** · 09-13-2008, 07:09 AM

Thank you so much! I didn't think places like Oxford and Cambridge asked for GRE scores, in fact I think the majority of grad schools abroad don't require it, from my research.

I'm doing research with grad students for free, going to keep up my GPA and come February, I will be studying for the GRE l, ike crazy. We'll see what happens.

My only concern is the LORs. I can get one from the econ prof I used to do research for, he's a great rec to show I have a mind outside the field and can do good research and article-writing. I also plan on getting one from my old battalion commander who's a full-bird colonel now, he told me whtever I needed to let him know. I want 2 from OSU faculty in the department. I am concerned because the school is so big that maybe I won't get to know everyone as well but the anthro department is relaively small and I am known for using office hours quite liberally so we'll see.

**offhegoes03** · 09-13-2008, 08:21 AM

yeah, good luck. When I was applying to grad school, I didn't know a ton of my old professors on a personal level, but I chose one that taught me twice and probably knew me pretty well, the one I did research with, and then a boss in the field. I guess just try to find someone that can say something about you other than what's on the transcript.

**NitemareHippieGirl** · 09-15-2008, 06:43 AM

Not to get the not really off-topic thread off topic again, now I'm wishing I'd majored in anthroplogy....

But, I guess for comforting reasons, supposing I or anyone else were to get a Masters in England do you think it would qualify you for jobs in the US, like in a university. Or does anyone know if a masters from a Uni in England would transfer to a PhD program in the US, or if it would be better to just get both degrees in the UK if I decide to do that... My parents are making me fear ruining my life. Though part of me thinks just moving overseas forever would be a brilliant idea, it's always nice to have the option of moving back home. Plus, my mom says my dad's heart will break if I disappear.

**travelchick75** · 09-15-2008, 07:13 AM

I'm almost positive that the U.S. will transfer a U.K. degree especially if its from a university like Oxford or Cambridge. Look at individual state schools that your hoping to apply to for your PHD and see what their admission requirements are for international students. That should give you a pretty good indication if they will take a foreign masters degree or not. Also look at any agreements that the universities have with universities in the UK (or elsewhere) as the universities will have a prior credit transfer agreement which would make the transition from one school to the other a hell of a lot easier.

**maracle** · 09-15-2008, 07:18 AM

I thought that most PhD programs just sort of come with a masters...like you would take classes but you don't have a strict curriculum like with a standard Master's program. So if your department is happy with your PhD work then you don't really need to worry about the masters. But I'm sure you could talk to some faculty at wherever you went for undergrad to see what they say. Anyway there are tons of foreign students studying in the US so I don't see how it can be a problem!

710 verbal on the GRE is pretty damn high...that has to be about as good as the scores get. Although I guess it maybe varies a lot by year. Nicole, I used Princeton Review's online program and it helped a ton, I guess if you're really disciplined you could just use a book for a lot less money but the structured program was really good for me.

As for letters, I had a bit of trouble with that too having gone to a big school and been away a lot for internships. I ended up with a letter from my boss at an 8 month internship, a letter from an anthro professor who had no clue who I was but I kicked ass in his class and had written a huge research paper for, and the third from a professor in my department (engineering) whose class I had a really good grade in. That guy also didn't really know me but he at least knew my name.

So I think my letters were kind of weak, only 1 out of 3 even knew who I was. I still got in to about half of the top tier places I applied to. My grades were nothing special, 3.3 GPA. My GREs were good but the median GRE scores are stupidly high so I don't think that did anything but not disqualify me.

My impression of the whole situation was that your admissions essays are really important. My strategy was to customize one of them for every school, which took time but I think it was helpful. I'd find professors with research I was interested in and specifically talk about it as a reason I was interested in applying and going there. I also would talk about specifics of the program if it had options like project vs thesis and which I was interested in. Everyone seems to apply all over the place so they have some trouble figuring out who is just shotgunning applications to anyone that will take them and who is really interested specifically in that department. If you can convince them that you want to go to their school only, that should count for a lot!

Maybe this is an excuse to go visit the admissions department there for both of you! :D

**pinknic38** · 09-15-2008, 08:03 AM

Ohio State's anthro department really helps you out, they will put you with a grad school mentor in your area of interest, they'll give you grad school advice, look at your apps, suggest GRE study stuff, etc. Kind of the hookup. We'll see.

How long did you study for the GRE for, Brett? I know one of my sorority sisters studied for the MCATs for like 3-4 months in advance and treated it like it was a college class, and gave it the same amount of time she gave her other classes, and she rocked the MCATs, and now goes to Northwestern. She's a rockstar though.

Anyway, most PhD programs do come with an MA too. But some programs require you to have an MA first. Some institutions do not grant MAs for non-PhD seekers, so in that instance if you go to a place like that, you're just not at the status of "candidate" for PhD or whatever until after you've completed 2 years (or the equivalent to an MA).

I would be better off getting my PhD at UTenn Knoxville because they've got this renowned forensic anthropology lab and that would be amazing experience, but Kathy Reichs, the big famous forensic anthropologist (for which the TV and Book series "Bones" is made after) went to Northwester and got her MA and PhD both there, so whatever. It's kind of free range anyway because you're immersed in your specialty anyway but my field is so specialized that it would behoove to go to UTK or LSU (who also has a fantastic program in the field) but if I got accepted to Cambridge, I would fucking go, forget about it! haha

**maracle** · 09-15-2008, 09:12 AM

I honestly studied my ass off...the GRE is completely stupid, it covers such pointless stuff. If you thought the SATs were lame this is in a whole different galaxy. I almost look at it as just a hurdle...do you want to go to grad school enough to waste a lot of hours preparing for this nonsense?

I was applying to engineering schools, and at a lot of them the median quantitative GRE scores would be 780 of 800 (and the scores go in 20 pt increments). The questions are mostly angles of triangles and other stuff you haven't thought about since 9th grade algebra. So I needed to relearn it, and learn how to do them pretty fast, and be near to perfect at it.

Anyway, I think I spent about 3 months working at it just because there was no room for error. It's been a while but I would guess I spent maybe 200-300 hours. That was probably overkill but application windows are tight so I figured I had one shot at it and needed to make it count.

I'm guessing for anthro they're probably a little more balanced in looking at verbal and writing scores as well. I actually think the prep is most effective on verbal, because you can use a lot of strategies to eliminate certain choices even when you have no clue of the answer. And the verbal is much much harder than quantitative, so everyone is getting a good number of them wrong...if you can get some correct when you don't know the vocabulary or in similar situations that helps a lot. Plus there's some other weird stuff to keep in mind...for example, getting the first question wrong will completely fuck you while getting the last one wrong is no big deal. So you learn to manage your time so you can be more careful at the beginning, etc.

So I guess the point of this is, you can improve your score a lot if you need it. There are sample computerized tests online, which is a lot better than the paper tests in books because the GREs are adaptive (they give you harder questions each time you answer right until you get one wrong). The nice thing at the schools I was looking at is that most of them published data on their median, 25th percentile and 75th percentile GPA and GRE scores. So with the data from the schools you're applying to and results from 1-2 computerized tests you can figure out how much work you need to do.